ChemistryAndPhysicsAreFun
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Feb 20, 2017 10:25 PM
ChemistryAndPhysicsAreFun
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kjwj
This makes me want to really fuck things up.
TurtleTwoTimes
Eman4evr
Looks like somebody failed Economics 101.
DigitalBang
Last one has a lot of arguments on it. Union ran city. High volume of democrats in seats of power.
Tubolts
It really bugs me (no pun intended) when people rail against the whole "robo-bees" thing.
PraiseGoogle
It's kind of crazy how the people that add the least amount of value to society get the most out of it.
PunkRockHerbivore
I saw the episode of Black Mirror about the robotic bees, no thanks.
RussianWat
Without the consequence of death, is this even science?
Dutch7
The American dream didnt say anything about doing what you love, our generation has been mislead to believe we have the right to make money
Dutch7
money is earned for valuable services. its simple, you want more money, provide a better, more unique service.
SpreadyUnsettling
But the American dream did say a lot about finding happiness and shit, and you have the second worst upwards social mobility in the west.
UmbertoBench
Corporatism is not capitalism. All these points are true but the first thing we need to do is get money out of politics.
SpaceAntelope
"I hate capitalism!" ::posts from iPhone::
Syntak
Don't dismiss the message because of the medium, if I bought my protest sign at walmart wouldn't I be just as culpable?
ChuckNorrisAteMySock
"I'm sure the lords who owned the pitchforks being carried by the peasants saw the irony in that as well."
Spiralhaze
"Hey! Isn't that my pi-Hurk! Yup... that's mine."
ShamnusMcfee
You don't drink for free if you own a bar. You're still the one buying the booze from the producers in the first place. Even if you're a
ShamnusMcfee
brewery, you still need to purchase ingredients, equipment, and invest the time.
tanner77
Hopefully he hired a capitalist to manager his bar or he won't have a bar for long.
usernamethativeneverusedbeforethisone
I'm self employed in the States. Although I agree with a lot of these; I will say that I risk everything I have and my family's(1)
usernamethativeneverusedbeforethisone
Well being to be self employed. I have more access to cash, and more freedom. But I risk everything, I cut my own check.
UmbertoBench
Well done. Do you think a better social safety net would encourage more entrepreneurism and risk taking? And make capitalism work better?
usernamethativeneverusedbeforethisone
The risk is the motivation sometimes
mrmessma
Funny this is being downvoted... Well ok it's not funny, but it is interesting.
mrmessma
I'll take what we have now (if this is late stage capitalism) over late stage socialism, communism, or fascism.
SpreadyUnsettling
Fair enough then. I'd also rather eat poop than lose my hands, but I'd rather just eat a nice sandwich, you know?
AndIThinkToMyselfWhatAWonderfulWorld
Interesting point. So you'd rather have the current system in the US with people bankrupted by healthcare costs than tax-funded healthcare?
mrmessma
The very few that don't get insurance are bankrupted. The vast majority that have it survive at much higher rates than those w/ tax funded.
Levatorscapulae
What you have now is early stage fascism, enabled by increased economic differences and xenophobia.
galantist
Good
weirdnorwegianguy
While I agree on alot of these, some of the posts seem a bit biased. But I do think that money should be more evenly distributed in the eco.
tanner77
Then go out and earn more of it.
thingy237
I love talking political theory irl, I don't like political spam on the internet.
PublicEnemaNo1
Communist. Socialist. And all bad words upon you for this heresy.
equityforpunks
That wouldn't matter as long as the people who get a lot of money also use a lot of money. It's impossible to prevent money piling up.
UmbertoBench
It's only impossible in the current political climate. Theoretically it's very possible and very desirable.
Entartika
As a history buff I'll take it over anything
forfour4nocation
Late stage resource based economy! It's coming through the mechanization of white collar work and the inevitable collapse of Fiat currency!
caboops
Cringe dump.
mufasa3356
It even makes the one somewhat humerous meme unbearable...
Cyseck
Yeah... I physically cringed harder at this than an actual cringe dump.
Khaotix11
Anarcho-capitalism and crony capitalism isn't usually what people mean when they say capitalism.
heyitsprisonmike
This made me sad.
Bortus
Yea, me too. Also a little concerned about my future -_-
NothingForNobody
What's the point of having a family if you're just setting them up to be wage slaves?
heyitsprisonmike
I've thought about this. I don't think I want to bring kids into this messed up world. All they're gonna do is work till they're dead.
heyitsprisonmike
#20andBroke
anubisfike
We are reverting back to serfdom. Corporations increasingly function like wealthy feudal land owners and employees like indentured servants.
SerialChillinSpree
'Excessive tax cuts for rich' Meh, not advocating that. How about a nice tax cut for the middle class. Oh, right, we support everything.
Ttsanch
As a Cuban fuck you. My dad is a teacher and gets pay 20 a month. A pair of jeans costs $30. Communism means equality everyone equally poor.
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Ttsanch
You think that because the Castros are better at cooking the books than Trump. It is not remotely true.
mufasa3356
Why don't you tell the 1-2% of the population that risks their life to run away every year how great they have it
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mufasa3356
Why go to Colombia when the us gives full citizenship to anyone who manages to escape. And yes, a lot of them go to surrounding countries
fesssstif
lol, colombia capitalist.
tanner77
They ran to the US, or at least they did before Obama enacted a Cuban Ban right before he left office that the left and the media ignored.
mufasa3356
Also. Infant mortality- forced abortions if any defects are found before birth
zFUBARz
Instead half of U.S. would rather force the birth then refuse to help the parents care for the child that needs immense resources to survive
HypnoChanger
There you have it folks, an American telling a Cuban that the Cuban doesn't know what it's like in Cuba.
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HypnoChanger
Yeah... They really don't. Cubans know what Cuba is like better than you do. They live there. You only read about it.
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Stostri
#22 Or, as the baby boomers are so fond of telling the millennials, "There's no such thing as a free lunch." Entitled indeed.
FakeKenAdams
I get school is expensive. But if you get a degree in a low paying field that's your own damn fault.
FakeKenAdams
I get that the problem, but you should know how expensive a degree is and how it pays. 400,000$ art degree then complain about the market?
zoidburgerandfries
Yeah! Like the sciences! Idiots!
Ringshadow
Look up rate of inflation for school cost vs rate of wage increase.
FakeKenAdams
Yeah school overall is too expensive. But I do see too many posts about debt and no jobs. Should know the market before selecting a degree.
Ringshadow
My degree was booming when I started it and had massive layoffs five months before graduation. What you're suggesting is not good enough.
AdmiralButtStuff
The Sciences feed Society's mind and body. The Arts feed Society's Soul. The problem isn't the degree, it's that schools are too expensive.
raider111111
And school is too expensive because of government.
AdmiralButtStuff
No. School is too expensive b/c greedy colleges and unis raised their tuitions to astronomical levels when money was made available >>
AdmiralButtStuff
to help more people get a college education. Costs have skyrocketed beyond inflation since the 80s when that money was made available.
Counterfit
And most of that additional money has gone to new administrative positions.
AdmiralButtStuff
Which in a lot of cases don't include new Professors and in some includes FEWER. It's a racket.
SqueakShow
What about those of us with science degrees still earning sweet fuck all?
Jethrie
That's the trick. Our best/brightest do work that pays really well but do little to help our society. Geniuses go into banking. That's bad.
KurtCobainCallsShotgun
What about our best and brightest who enter scientific fields? Are they doing little help?
Jethrie
American culture overwhelmingly values success as monetary. Those who want to be "successful" work to make money. Not trying to argue, hoss.
KurtCobainCallsShotgun
Or engineering.
Jethrie
What is the best engineering university in the country? Harvard, Yale, some Ivy League school? Or a state college? Where do the elites go?
KurtCobainCallsShotgun
MIT
WanPannnnnnnnnnnnch
Capitalism put simply, is about incentive and disincentive.
UmbertoBench
Yeah, capitalism is an emergent property of human interaction. And Socialism and Corporatism are two forms capitalism can take on. Kinda.
WanPannnnnnnnnnnnch
No matter which economic platform is used the rules of capitalism will always apply.
mufasa3356
Except for communism? In my country it used to be better to work at a food distribution than to be an engineer.Higher chances of getting fed
noghiri
Visible in the underground "favor economy" that grew up in soviet Russia.
leroy666
No, its about greed!
tanner77
Greed is in human nature, not any specific economic system. Greed exists in socialism & communism w/power of state to enforce it.
tanner77
Read Animal Farm by Orwell or simply just look at the power class in any socialist or communist society.
leroy666
Finland, Norway, Iceland, Sweden! Only countries that have adapted democratic socialism to suit their situations. USSR & China were never!
leroy666
Communism is not and never has been socialism. Except in the fevered imaginations of the robber barons. (Trump)
WanPannnnnnnnnnnnch
I'm sorry if that's how you feel about it, and many do but no, it's not about "greed". Think about what incentive you have to buy something
leroy666
Kinda thought it was very Darwinian. Claw to the top and fuck everyone else. How rich would the trumpet be if he hadn't been born rich
WanPannnnnnnnnnnnch
or what turned you away from a product/ service. That's capitalism plane and simple. There is profit or loss of profit which ever direction
usernamepickingsucks
The whole argument is skewed in such a way that the govenment kinda gets to get us fighting then sneak away in the commotion. 1/2
usernamepickingsucks
A tax on certain things is fine. An income tax is theft under threat of force.
JudgeMentalCat
Not just that- the work you do, your boss or employer takes a large cut of the wealth produced.
Ensano
Because they put up the risk and capital. A company invests 10 million dollars and if they're wrong lose it all and you expect to walk in
Ensano
And get a 50/50 cut?
Ensano
Lol @ the downvotes. But but, I order the office supplies. I should make just as much as the owner.
JudgeMentalCat
That tax on your labor, created by the current employment system, is in and of itself theft.
JudgeMentalCat
If a business was controlled by its workers instead of owned by someone, things would be far more free and equitable.
vibrantlightsaber
And ineffective and out of business in quick fashion likely.
equityforpunks
Business controlled by workers is called enterpeneurship.....
AdmiralButtStuff
And guess who is funding the politicians that become The Government.
fearinyou
Please don't blanket name "corporations." Please don't. Say Citigroup, or wall street, but don't say "corporations."
AdmiralButtStuff
Why is that unfair? Citizens United allowed wealthy corporations to funnel practically unlimited funds into campaign coffers.
AdmiralButtStuff
The insurance corporations that forced Congress and Obama to hamstring the ACA to protect their profit margins.
AdmiralButtStuff
Or the banks that took billions in bailout money and STILL paid their CEOS (who had driven them to bankruptcy) millions of $s in bonuses
AdmiralButtStuff
Sure, it's not -all- corporations, but you damn well better believe it's the biggest ones. The ones pushing for mergers that deny us options
AdmiralButtStuff
They also pay professional lobbyists to go into Congress and meet with our Senators and Reps and push whatever their agenda is.
AdmiralButtStuff
Capitalism is great. Unregulated capitalism is not. It is precisely why we created things like a federal minimum wage, OSHA, and the EPA.
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lmOIdGREEGG
cough socialist scandinavian countries cough
WombatOne
Umm, nordic countries are backing away from past socialist policies and are taking on a more balanced approach 1/2
WombatOne
http://www.economist.com/news/leaders/21571136-politicians-both-right-and-left-could-learn-nordic-countries-next-supermodel 2/2
SpreadyUnsettling
Which is also making us some of the most unequal countries in the world in certain aspects, and is rapidly eroding our climate initiatives,
Ruhig
Surely the free market will balance itself out! In a way that's safe and gentle for everyone! No horrific bloodshed at all!
geetarhumor
And then we elected someone who's trying to convince us that all of those things are bad for a healthy economy.
shdwklown
I'll give ya that trump is terrible, but this mess got a huge boost when Reagan took office in '80.
Sneetsnoot
But, but Regan was the greatest president ever right?
wellthisjustgotinteresting
Pure capitalism is dreadful. Pure socialism is dreadful. We need a blend, because people suck.
fearinyou
EPA, OSHA, labor laws, are ALL the wrong type of regulations. Ffs.
LizardEnterprises
I'm curious what the excuse will be in 6 months, when none of those things exist...
flarflarf
Agree, but It's become far too unregulated lately imo.
ImgonnapartylikeitsCOVID1999
The EPA will be gone soon. Give it 4 years
thecuteocalypseishere
And then people will get angry. We'll bring it back. Different people will get angry. We'll get rid of it again. This is fucking depressing.
lonelylinguist
Maybe if human lifespans were much longer, people would have to deal w/ the consequences of their decisions & make fewer recurring mistakes?
shmekie
Maybe if it wasn't so easy to reproduce or if real sexual education was mandated or anti-intellectualism didn't exist or fuck I broke again
shmekie
Maybe if it wasn't so easy to reproduce or if real sexual education was mandated or anti-intellectualism didn't exist or fuck I broke again
thelazyninja
Fuck I hope not. 75 F degree days in February? 2016 hottest year on record? We need the EPA to help mitigate climate change.
AndIThinkToMyselfWhatAWonderfulWorld
Good luck with that while the cheeto's in charge
IlluminaBlade
Fake temperatures!
Redefiningme
"Alternative temperatures"
DrKriegersClone
Pay no attention to the Chinese Hoax going on right outside your window.
thelazyninja
Read this in Kreiger's voice. Nice.
ThanksIHateThis
Do people not understand the socio-economic differences between capitalism and corporatism?
APersonWhoUsesImgur
Capitalism (in its "late stage") has been redefined to mean corporatism. "Capitalists" who are not in favor of corporatism need a new word.
semtex94
The concept of capitalism is creating personal wealth by exploiting others labor, or selling your labor at a fraction of its true value.
equityforpunks
Yup. These problems are mostly due to bad politics, not capitalism. Regulate with taxes & use them to provide equality of opportunity.
AdmiralButtStuff
Capitalism is about doing everything possible to drive profits and that mentality causes most of the problems. Regulations act as checks.
equityforpunks
2/2 The "make profit at all cost" is just injected in it by greedy people. It is not inherit part of capitalism.
Tkeleth
Ah, I see you're from that awesome place where complex socioeconomic systems are flawless, like their textbook definitions. Lucky!!
equityforpunks
Capitalism isn't about doing every possible for profits. It is set of free markets, free ownership, and freedom to collect profit.. 1/2
theGrantimus
Don't tell the Anarcho-Capitalists.
TheVakarian
All six of them.
theGrantimus
Not counting the ones who talk the talk but won't walk the walk?
imgurforants
Minimum wage actually hurts lower class workers. Small business's need to pay less taxes to pay workers more.
BooToast
That literally never happens. Small businesses have to generate revenue in order to be taxed. Taxes aren't killing your business, (1)
BooToast
Or hour ability to pay employees, the way you handle your business is killing your business. Source: I'm a small business owner. (2)
FrostMarvel
This. Increases minimum wage, etc. just drives up inflation.
BooToast
What's driving up inflation right now is easy credit.
AtomIndigo
Also, fractional reserve banking.
BooToast
Yup
HorseMcFucker
>Capitalism Is great http://cdn.meme.am/instances/58135684.jpg
TheToll
>using arrow on imgur http://cdn.meme.am/instances/58135684.jpg
HorseMcFucker
>Being too lazy to google his own meme https://cdn.meme.am/cache/instances/folder794/13690794.jpg
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HorseMcFucker
>Calling greentext memearrows. https://averyteoda.files.wordpress.com/2015/08/are-you-fucking-kidding-me.jpg?w=584
JudgeMentalCat
The things you think are exclusive to capitalism- like markets, luxury goods, opportunity- are great. The suffering that capitalisn
JudgeMentalCat
**capitalism requires to function is not great.
AdmiralButtStuff
Did you just read the first sentence or are you trying to clarify what I said to me for some other reason?
JudgeMentalCat
There was a second comment. But my point is that- the things that are "great" about capitalism can exist without it, but the bad stuff
JudgeMentalCat
can't go away unless capitalism is fundamentally changed or simply done away with.
equityforpunks
You should probably read at least the wikipedia page of capitalism..
JudgeMentalCat
Capitalism requires suffering, requires expropriation of labor. However, stuff like luxury goods and markets can exist without it
iconior
minimum wage is actually a detriment to those in poverty. A company wants to hire you for $5/hr, but MW is $8/hr. you get no job and $0/hr
pauliewalnutsgabaghool
I love capitalism.
TylerTheAnarchist
Same I'm getting "Capitalist" but with an "anarchy A" tattooed on my leg for my birthday.
tanner77
Me too. Capitalism is the reason America, even with all her problems, is still the envy of the entire world.
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tanner77
Obomba is by far our most war-like President in history. So it makes sense this report would come out after he told Bush to hold his beer.
ganjix
'the envy of the entire world' - oh boy are you wrong
tanner77
I've traveled the world a lot and everyone always bad mouths America until they eventually admit to me they want to live here.
Levatorscapulae
It's not. At the moment it is a horrific example of what lack of free, high standard education does to a country.
tanner77
It's true. We've allowed the Left too much control of education, culture, & government over the last 40 years & we've suffered for it.
UmbertoBench
Specifically, what has the left taught in schools that has led to present problems?
mattconan
Now do late stage socialism
leroy666
Scandinavia
hoboface
All capitalist countries.
stiggypa
Now play Classical Gas.
SirBrendan
Finalnd? It's doing pretty great...
hoboface
A capitalist country. Like every other nordic country. Free healthcare != socialism.
CrystalToucher
Finland is scrapping most of its socialist programs for a reverse income tax system because the socialist systems aren't working
yoozernaiym
Isn't it more of a social democracy though? It's not actually socialist anyway, I know that much
NocturnOwlEMissions
How about late stage communism, like China, bringing 400 million people out of poverty since 1960 and is only now slowing with capitalism?
mattconan
China only started developing when it adopted capitalist economic policies in the 1980s.
smaug777000
no, socialism is good, except for every time it's tried
KurtCobainCallsShotgun
Good in theory?
smaug777000
I don't like a theory where the government seizes the means of production
KurtCobainCallsShotgun
Neither do I, I phrased it weird. What I meant was that people may find the whole "sharing is caring" thing to be appealing.
semtex94
You mean all those dictatorships? Run by autocrats with no checks on their power?
DrKriegersClone
People call everything from Scandinavian social democrat models to NK communism "socialist". It's so vague it's basically meaningless.
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flarflarf
Good, neither do I. Unfortunately, most Americans do.
Gozzu
They're by definition socialism. Same with our unions having legislative power.
CrystalToucher
Late stage socialism only killed ~100 million people in the last century
flarflarf
data point: more people died of starvation in capitalist India than did in China during the Great Leap Forward.
GodEmperorOfImgur
If we include both of the latest famines, then the loss of life in india was 14 million. Scholars estimate 30 million in the great leap.
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GodEmperorOfImgur
A bit high, even the most liberal estimation puts it at 45 million, most likely around 30 million. Still bad, super bad, but not THAT bad.
flarflarf
Pretty sure British-ruled India was capitalist. Not a communist, just sayin.
fesssstif
british ruled india was mercantilist, which is very different. The simple existence of governement monopoly is an abomination
tanner77
I'm pretty sure India's problems had as much if not more to do with their racist caste system than capitalism or socialism.
StopLookingAtMyName
There are two types of late-stage socialism. The one where they realise you need a mix of capitalism and socialism, or communism.
GnarredGnarly
It's almost like every government around the world has mixed policies. Including the US.
stopseriously
So. Well. Put.
mongolmatt
As a Holder of an MA in poli sci just no.....
UmbertoBench
* holder, not Holder.
mongolmatt
Thats grammar not spelling, also brain will fill in non important details. This is also the internet, not a peer reviewed published paper.
tanner77
You might check about a refund.
mongolmatt
Yes because people confuse their google with my MA
mufasa3356
Lol, if you're gonna pull rank with no facts, at least spell properly.
mongolmatt
If people listened to facts we wouldn't have trump for president...
StopLookingAtMyName
We haven't really had the first one around long enough to see how it ends up, but communism gets unsustainable with impressive speed.
candythesquirrel
It's because communism is a disaster-response system, that you should abandon the moment the danger is gone.
Enderskild
That makes sense, but the "late stage capitalism" idea from Hegelian idealism proposes Communism as a semi-permanent state.
AndIThinkToMyselfWhatAWonderfulWorld
It could be said that the first type has been around since at least 1946 with the introduction of the NHS in Britain- that's a similar 1/2
Enderskild
Social Security is significantly older. Preaching absolutes is an old Communist idea- makes for good speech fodder, bad economics.
AndIThinkToMyselfWhatAWonderfulWorld
Time frame to how long Communism was prevalent in Russia- 71 years vs 74
Flanaganarightinthepussy
apple store employees DO NOT get poverty wages. the "geniuses" get paid way too much to basically tell you to buy a new phone and do nothing
nclu
Also, wasn't the Chinese worker suicide rate equal to other population groups but the absolute numbers are larger with that many employees?
hiddenchild
As a former Apple Store employee. We get paid insanely high in comparison to others. Not to mention full benefits
strawmanAlert
My sister gets $14 an hour so she can live in a 2br apt with 4 people. But yeah I guess that's not poverty. I'll stop buying her groceries.
marody
Wish I got that kind of money working as a doctor
davethebiker
I make over 17 at a call center and bought a house and support my wife and son. Its about WHERE you are.
lysani
Exactly. Where I live, min. wage is more than enough to live on, while something like $15/hr in CA is barely enough to get by.
AtomIndigo
If someone is getting shit wages and can barely get by, how do you propose they get the funds to uproot their life and move?
davethebiker
That's my point. Some places 15/hr is plenty to be comfortable, some it is not. I personally am doing ok where I am. Others not so much. 1/?
davethebiker
2/? The issue is that certain political persuasions figure "working harder, better jobs, college and moving" are the answers, but they 3/?
ideologist
It's an entry-level job, bro
strawmanAlert
Whoosh.
JohnnyTitelips
50 years ago people would have lost their shit if you couldn't support yourself, your wife, and at least one child on entry level pay.
tanner77
They learned to save their money and they learned trades and skills. 2
JohnnyTitelips
I'm not talking about the trades. I'm talking about a cashier in a grocery store or a janitor in a hospital.
tanner77
People didn't have mobile data plans, internet service, and they didn't spend most of their free time surfing the web or binging netflix. 1
ideologist
See my reply, he's a whiner
ideologist
Wife stays at home, home is a tenement, no frills and everything is made and repaired at home. Not as expensive as you'd think.
JohnnyTitelips
Federal minimum wage in 1967 is $10.18 in 2017 dollars. And that's federal. Almost every single state has a higher minumum wage than (1/2)
JaketheBurningMan
A full-time job should support yourself. If you need 3 incomes just to keep a roof over your head, something has gone wrong.
tanner77
Go out and get a better paying job! Learn some sales skills. Learn to code for free on the internet. Learn a trade.
tanner77
Go out and get a better paying job! Learn some sales skills. Learn to code for free on the internet. Learn a trade.
vibrantlightsaber
Those aren't three incomes, those are three entry level jobs. Stick to it, move up trough management, leverage skills.
AlkeneThiol
And where do you live in the mean time? What if you have kids? What if your skill became obsolete?
tanner77
You're absolutely right, but everyone downvotes you because their lazy and entitled.
ElCabaro
If I may weigh in, I work in Walmart's electronics department. They started me at $10.50 per hour. Definitely not a "poverty wage"
Luthrid
I started at $10/hr 6 years ago. I make $13 now. Both were above the min wage at the time by a fair bit. Neither have ever been livable.
NapoleonDynOmite
You're right. Where I live that's below poverty.
stabbedintheface
You couldn't rent a tent on that where I live.
crockmonster
Depends on where you live. Where I am (BC), I earn $10.85 and cost of living is really high, I had to move back home.
yveris
the problem is that you're so used to wages being sub $15 an hour, that you think they get "paid way too much"
marody
Wish I got that much money for being a doctor and working > 80 weeks.
mthrndr01
One system being monumentally stupid doesn't mean that the other system isn't also stupid. We all wish people got paid reasonable wages.
ThatGuyWhoIsAlwaysThatGuy
The joys of residency
Mittenfrisker
Fuck people downvoting this. I did two residencies, seven years. The math worked out to less than minimum wage. These guys have it right.
zFUBARz
It's almost as if somebody wants all new doctors to be buried in debt and have an incentive to reject their morals just a little bit.
DammitIHadSomethingForThis
If you live in the US, it's. Illegal for them to do that
AlkeneThiol
Why were you in residency so long? Is that normal nowadays?