KillswitchLtd
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Y'all people about to learn some shit.
You see this? This is Finland. More accurate, finnish conscripts performing their vow to protect their homeland with the skills they learn during conscription. At this point in time, they have served for 8 weeks and have learned the absolute basics about being a soldier
So as said, Finland has mandatory military conscription for all able-bodied men (and women if they want). If guns are not your things, you may opt for a 12 months 'civil service job' instead.
The conscription is a period between 6-12 months, depending on the training you go through, 6 for basic infantry, 9 for medic, military police and other special jobs such as dog handler and finally 12 for NCO or Officer training or military driver.
In 1995, it was decided that women should also be allowed to draft if they so wished. The applicants had to physically fit and mentally healthy just as their male counterparts. Every year about 21000 conscripts enter into service, out of which about 400 are women on average.
The women depicted is a sergeant who decided to stay and work for the military, made clear by the tiny sword.
As with any military, conscripts may apply to serve in the army, navy or air force, depending a little on where you live and where the bases are located.
By default every soldier will atleast reach the rank of private. If you opt to serve for 12 months and go through leadership training you will become a Corporal, Sergeant or 2nd Lieutenant, depending on how well you serve and a bit what you wish to do.
There is also the possibility of special training such a pilot school, rapid deployment forces, border guard and para-troopers but they require special applications and test for you to be able to get in.
I know i am only scratching the surface of this subject with this post, but bare with me. You have any questions on the subject, ill be happy to attempt to answer with the best of my knowledge.
I myself served 12 months in the Army as a mortar company Corporal.
The military was a great experience and the majority of finnish men will agree with me.
Hersy
The Swiss employ a similar policy I think... As an aussie I wish we did this. Would solve a lot of issues...
IBuyCheeseburgersAndBeerForFirstDate
Been there, done that. Yay Finland!
BenefitOfMrKite
Mikä mies, mikä siivousalue?
starfight
This year we hit the record for most women to ever apply
labellachaos
I have so much more respect for Finland now, thank you!
Disin
I was in the second to last conscript wave in Sweden. It used to be the same.
ScrubsPosts
I think the US should do this but add a third option: work in retail or serve tables for a year
The2020ElectionWasStolen
bad idea - you may end up wanting to assist the enemy in killing your fellow countrymen
onkko
Propaganda film with english subtitles https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LHLEY4uIqno
xtraa
Forget about all these military services propaganda. Let's honor the people of postal services, they are much more relevant for life.
thekreat
Everybody I know bitches the entire time of their deployment, but after couple years everybody remembers just the good parts. I didn't go.
SingleFlamingle
@OP +1 Soviets beat the Nazis but just couldn't quite beat the Finns.
t3hbernardo
https://static.ylilauta.org/files/r1/orig/7tbeccqw/Mortit.mp4
LavaAxe
Is that corpral Kimi motherfucking Räikkönen?
Bojingles
USAF SSgt here, I got to hangout with the Finnish military a few weeks ago. They're a lot of fun and will drink you under the table.
LavaAxe
You with the Oregon Air National Guard? They were here in Finland some time ago on a training assignment.
Bojingles
No, active duty in Germany.
cuteandcuddly
I'd like to serve for 12 months and retire as an NCO
LavaAxe
Remember there is no pay involved here. None of these conscripts get paid.
Riisseli
They do get certain amount of daily allowance.
Pullout69
It's not a draft for women if they only join when thy wish.
McDongpants
It's kinda cheap to argue semantics with a non native English speaker, yes?
Pullout69
I think you're overstating the point. They seemed to understand what o meant just fine.
LavaAxe
They're volunteers, yes. Only volunteers in the force, besides employed personnel.
prettypinkbaby
I love Finland ????
ClimbingMonkey
Apart from terror, has the army been involved in any armed conflict recently?
LavaAxe
Army itself, no. Finnish military advisers are however training Kurdish fighters in Iraq to fight against ISIS.
onkko
Finnish army is active in peace keeping operations. https://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luettelo_Suomen_rauhanturvaoperaatioista
onkko
Finnish army has one job, being credible deterrent against russia. Do you really want to try? Look at support, youll be fuckd.
onkko
By support i mean "about 80% of finns support armed response even if outcome is unclear" so invade but what then?
wonder89
Sharing a border with Russia is dangerous enough.
KillswitchLtd
No not to my knowledge. The last time the army was in open conflict was during the 2nd world war
fer0s
Served 12 months in Finnish military :P
nigelandco
Vasen, vasen...
onkko
Vasen, kaks, kolme
Ketheres
Vasen-Oikee-Vasen-Oikee eioo-vaikee
Jaymayn
Äitii äitii tänne mä jään, siviilissä mulla hajoo pää
OrangelightingZAZAZING
Aamuja
E1M1Phobos
Reservin aurinko on paistanut jo monta päivää... 1/14
LeQna12
"Dägä" for the swedish speaking finns
Migreeniminuutissa
KOLLAA KESTI, KKTA EI JÄTETÄ, TALI-IHANTALA, SUOMI KONEPISTOOLI, TORILLA TAVATAAN!
torillatavataan
Nimimerkkinne täsmää, hyvä herra.
Jaymayn
TORILLEEEEEEEE SUOMI MAINITTU
GarthStClaire
From a military point of view, conscripts are the worst soldiers there are. They generally have low moral (because they are forced to be 1/
GarthStClaire
there instead of choosing to fight, are more likely to desert, break psychologically, do rotten stuff etc.) Personally I consider 2/
GarthStClaire
conscription and unacceptable intrusion into personal freedom. Economically, conscripted civil servants are exploited and take up jobs 3/
GarthStClaire
that could be given to unemployed people. Fuck conscription.
SideEffectsOfJuice
Military driver reporting in
JaL3
Fellow ratti-Matti here! KaiPr 1/91. Fuck I'm old..
SideEffectsOfJuice
Don't worry, I'll stay off your lawn. KaartJR 2/12 :D
LavaAxe
BMP-2 gunner, sleeping in the turret.
MaximumOverStripes
Air Defence NCO, reporting in!
hisholybeardness
If the service is mandatory then do they allow applicants to go in intelligence (military/govt)? Or do they have to pass other tests for it?
Antermosiph
When it comes to a national program with massive participation its generally pretty bloated and shitty quality overall.
equityforpunks
It's same shit for all. Was such waste of time that I decided to quit after 1st week and go back school. Had to pull tricks avoid going back
Kaalivanukas
Conscripts rarely deal in major intelligence roles. But there are mil intel roles with a special application and loads of tests.
knobhoblin
I enjoyed my time in the Army (atleast in hindgsight). Would do it again, but better.
KillswitchLtd
Same
HoldingAccount
I didn't. But the refresher course (kertausharjoitukset) have been a lot better since I've 3 kids now :D I'm 1st lieutnant now.
knobhoblin
Still haven't had mine! Though my watch ended only like six years ago
pazuzu
Finnish bullets:
The2020ElectionWasStolen
nokilla
MacDaddySmitt
aka the invention of bombproof material!
Relevant2Post
Armour*
Dargrind
Multiple use*
CynicalClinicalWalrus
Sandbag*
MisterRekt
Why not both?
SideEffectsOfJuice
¿Porque no los dos? (ja sama ruotsiksi)
Ewanator
sqqqq2
How are the women conscripts if they choose to join or not?
TheArcticAC
The nordics use a system of national service. Some are forced other go willingly, you are in the reserves for some twenty years after.
TheArcticAC
The result is that once you are in because youhave signed the draft papers, you don't really have a choice anymore. They have you
LavaAxe
Women have a grace period until that vow in #1 where they can just call it quits any time they want with no repercussions.
InFin0819
I think they are otherwise forced into civil service
KillswitchLtd
No theh arent?
KillswitchLtd
If a women feels like the military might be a place for her, she simply applies with a form and visits a doctor for a basic check up
sqqqq2
Then it isn't conscription. A conscript is someone who is put into the armed forces unwillingly.
KillswitchLtd
Which is why i pointed out in the post already if they want to
sqqqq2
But if they WANT to, it isn't conscription. Its just 'joining the army'.
McDongpants
Bruh, OP clearly doesn't speak English as a first language. Maybe cut him some slack?
KillswitchLtd
Well sorry for my wrong terminology... Do you feel better now that you have proven me wrong?
Flippinballz
I served for 9 fucking months and absolutely hated most of it. Only a handfull of things i consider good experiences.
Skrudd
Being in the army taught me to appreciate what I have. I got a small taste of suffering that really put things into perspective.
farwall
So when it says you serve 6-12 months, who decides how long you serve? It doesn't sound like you decided to do 9 rather than 6.
HoldingAccount
The military picks it for you usually. You can apply for certain specific roles that have 6/9/12 month training, such as NCO-training.
onkko
Wait few years, over 20 years since armed service and i see value of it. It was annoying but it did made me what im today.
Antermosiph
There's a point when you've done something so long it seems valuable. People felt coal mining was a good aspiration.
onkko
What you mean? I did mandatory 8 months 20 years ago.
Antermosiph
Oh I thought you said you were in it for 20 years, apologies.
BOOKGIRL21
Thank you for giving us the educational overview - it is helpful to see how other countries handle their military service.
knarlygoat
So that we may develop strategies to beat them...
NotNotDeadpool
Generally better than the us.
mynameisnotalice
In Germany it was the same until a few years ago. Then mandatory drafting was abolished because they wanted gender equality and the (1)
mynameisnotalice
military already is a little too large. And now nobody needs to do mandatory service any longer. (2)
KillswitchLtd
You are most welcome!
dvddspcofmrca
Wish we did this in US; would humble some of our entitled youth & teach military ppl they aren't special just because they joined; its earnd
SideEffectsOfJuice
In the end, after the service is over, it's quite questionable how fit for any actual action the people sent to reserve are :p
SideEffectsOfJuice
Also it's not always so peachy in reality. They often don't pick the most fit leaders for NCO training, for example. Whoever wants... or >
SideEffectsOfJuice
4> be a really different experience depending on what kind of people end up being the NCOs serving their second half of the year.
SideEffectsOfJuice
3> This is true for every role that's part of the mandatory service actually. So, the basic training period (ending in the vow in #1) can >
SideEffectsOfJuice
2> even, if not enough people want to go, they can pretty much random pick just avoiding the absolute worst ones, to be trained at NCOs. >
SideEffectsOfJuice
I would think that if anything your military "earned" it more, as when the service is mandatory you can't really say you earned anything.
dvddspcofmrca
Also to clarify, not at all saying ppl in the military have not earned their valor, I am not anti-military & am angry at how are veterans (1
dvddspcofmrca
That is a good point. I should clarify & say that people earn their valor by their actions within the military not just because they joined
dvddspcofmrca
Are treated as they deserve so much respect and gratitude. I know Americans can be better ppl and sorry if I'm just rambling about things (2
SideEffectsOfJuice
4> discussion to be had on whether those who sign up to fight for justice actually end up fighting for justice, instead of e.g. greed)
SideEffectsOfJuice
I agree with everything. Not rambling at all, although I would have understood w/o the clarification :) I do respect anyone willing to >
SideEffectsOfJuice
2> ACTUALLY fight to defend the freedom and rights of their country and even more for those willing to do the same for those outside their >
SideEffectsOfJuice
3> country as well. Of course this does not automatically apply to everyone serving. (And there's certainly a completely different >
Mysterym4n
I've often thought Australia could benefit from a program like this. Too many of us take for granted what we have here and never give back
MonsterRooster
Finland shares 1340 km border with Russia.
PangolinBan
Not to be the equality idiot, but as a guy I'm not happy delaying my career by a year compared to women my age. Budget-wise this is a 1/2
Mysterym4n
I would make women serve too.
PangolinBan
2/2 significant burden on a country's budget too, and it's not like most countries don't consistently run budget deficits already either.
HoldingAccount
This is offset - at least partially - with the fact that the salary costs are much smaller.
PangolinBan
Are you referring to the difference in pay between conscripts and career military? Because you can't really substitute conscripts for 1/2
PangolinBan
2/2 "real" soldiers IMO. And obviously there's the huge logistical cost, and the hidden costs to the economy.
HoldingAccount
Finland has conscripts and career military. If we didn't have conscripts, we would have to get a lot more paid soldiers, which would 1/2