So here's what happened. To fund the arts, laws went into place in many cities where 1% of the cost of a building had to be set aside for the arts. But they forgot for spread the funding as a requirement. So many governments interpreted this as a way to "one and done it". They hired one shitty artist to make one terrible peice, then they valued it as worth 1% the cost of the building. This lowered standard the of public works, which then itself became a standard as acceptable artworks.
Love modern art. Only art field where the point is for humans to be so unhinged weird that even the best of the artist and critics get confused trying to make meaning of it.
Sometimes they're mocking the viewers and the viewers get it and are there for the joke. A lot of weird midcentury art was directly and unsubtly making fun of the art industry and the very idea of commercialized art, and the art industry ate it up and paid tons of money for it
I once saw a huge plywood box/room covered with pieces of bologna (like hundreds of pieces) nailed to it, with faces painted on them. And that wasn’t the weirdest thing there either. Whitney Biennial NYC.
Shit like this makes me resonate with Robert Henri when he criticized the tail end of the Impressionism movement, which he would refer to as "Academic", art for the sake of being art rather than any real expression.
If I were to run into any other building, wearing only boxer shorts, and start screaming and crying while using a sledgehammer to smash a bunch of fruits with insults written on them, ending with screaming "Look what you made me do!" before running off crying, I'd be institutionalized. If I did it at one of these art galleries, I'd get an exhibit and reviews.
Okay but Im kind of into it after seeing a good performance once. It was by one of the dude's father of Metalica so retirement was locked and he was just this eccentric dude with a trope being weird. It was lights, movement, sounds, wind, big ribbons of fabric, "music" painting things weird in weird ways that all just flowed together. A small audience w no judgement about being into it. It was also before the pervasiveness of phones/ social media so no one seemed to be there just for the cred
Look, if it weren’t for the avant garde, art wouldn’t progress. You don’t have to like it or even get it, but it does matter. I’ve seen some black box plays that made me deeply uncomfortable in indescribable ways and I never saw those playwrights again, but such things need to exist to push boundaries and find new paths
Totally agree. I feel that for a chunk of people, the expectation is that art is there to look pretty, stuff that's confronting or confusing the gut reaction is to reject it rather than to sit with it or figure out your own interpretation (right or wrong).
Yep, just like everything else, art requires a lot of experimentation and failure to get to the good stuff. Otherwise you just end up in the Jack Donaghy mode of "art is paintings of horses, end of list."
Sorry, what is a better, non-strawman way, for me to say there are actually people that do enjoy this stuff and aren't there out of a sense of obligation?
Ok, accepted. I kinda agree with you actually. Some of them might enjoy it, or at least appreciate the performances. I, however, also suspect that many are there because they're expected to be there.
I will fully defend the right of each and every one of them to express themselves in any manner in which they choose. But I also will have the right to think to myself…what the absolute fuck?
Agreed. Now, obviously not all performance art is inherently bad, but most of it has me thinking that the performer craves actor/musician level attention centered on their person (instead of their art, which should speak for itself) but lacks the discipline to learn an instrument or hone their acting skills/memorize their lines. In all fairness, a lot of of the more classic art styles, like f.e. painting and sculpting, have their fair share of hacks as well.
Oh no argument from me there. Most modern art is first of all selling the artist, then people buy into their art. Regardless of technical skill or substance
Yeah, it's pretty sad. Also, apparently a lot of tax evasion via art donations to museums... after commissioning an artist friend to paint something and paying an art appraiser friend to declare it is worth a lot of cash, so you can write off any amount you want. Atrocious practice, that.
Do you think part of that is knowing that what you’re going to do is crap and you have more self respect than laying on the floor screaming and asking money for it? There’s a lot of “the emperor's new clothes” going on here
I have another opinion: performance art is what it is (= human doing things and you watch) and it should do what it does (= make you talk/think about it). So whatever I don't like it.
Yeah, but he could have popped into a shop at the last minute and picked up a few trays of eggs. Put them around the floor and it's job done. Very ortistic.
Contemporary art is a kind of language, if you haven’t read/studied the history and theory it doesn’t make a lot of sense. The problem is that it’s language-ness makes it seem exclusive to people with the time and money to seek it out. The secret is to not take it that seriously in the first place, and find ways to enjoy it, even if it’s like “shit I’ve never seen THAT before.”
If it isn't an outright money laundering scam, it's done by a pretentious, elitist prick of an artist who sometimes literally shits on canvas and tells us it's a dream.
So you’re saying that his absurdist performance had enough impact on you that you still think of it now… whether for better or worse, nobody knows… but it has definitely had an effect…
do you say the same about jazz, poetry, ballet, and other ‘high art’ forms? There’s definitely some exclusive gate-keeping wankery that goes on, but writing off these modes of human expression is part of the anti-intellectualism that runs dangerously through US society. I don’t understand DnD or football, but I don’t think people are pricks for enjoying those things 🤷♂️
I would say it about poetry that didn't use words, meter, or rhyme, or jazz that didn't use instruments or have any rhythm. "Art" that lacks any talent or skill to produce, beauty, perceptible message, or anything else of any artistic merit is, not surprisingly, a pile of worthless garbage.
But you can see it right? The medium is visual art. Just because you can’t perceive a message doesn’t mean it isn’t there… “I don’t understand this therefore it is garbage” is a bit of a lame take.
Not really. If the artist is attempting to express themselves and nobody understands what they're doing, then they have failed. If they're trying to evoke a reaction and all they get is blank looks and vague embarrassment then they have failed. There are, mathematically speaking, infinite messages in a block of random noise, it just depends how you decrypt it.
I think the difference is, if you don't understand football or D&D, but ask someone who does to describe it to you, the answer is usually given in excitement and joy. If you ask a fan of truly avant garde art, though, you usually get a pretentious, haughty, disdainful, or downright rude answer. "You wouldn't understand." Not always, of course, but often enough that people associate avant garde with people pretending cheap trash is art.
GuyLuomo
Wiggling Leg Girl get my vote.
philmoregraves
The black body suits while sprinkling colored sand or w/e over them looked kinda cool
fofunn
Freestila
This is not Art. This is what my kids do if we look away for a minute.
PenguinNamedWobbles
So here's what happened. To fund the arts, laws went into place in many cities where 1% of the cost of a building had to be set aside for the arts. But they forgot for spread the funding as a requirement. So many governments interpreted this as a way to "one and done it". They hired one shitty artist to make one terrible peice, then they valued it as worth 1% the cost of the building. This lowered standard the of public works, which then itself became a standard as acceptable artworks.
Drylegs
Love modern art. Only art field where the point is for humans to be so unhinged weird that even the best of the artist and critics get confused trying to make meaning of it.
UnhelpfulAnswers
I would get kicked out SOOOO quick
doodlemyster
Honestly I couldn't keep a straight face the whole vid
DavidHoag
My eyes just rolled out of my f*cking head.
WeAreNotSmilesTImes
Who knew restless legs were art?
leoda2023
Often I believe the "artists" are simply mocking the viewers with their "art" and the viewers just don't get the joke.
WellAckchually
Sometimes they're mocking the viewers and the viewers get it and are there for the joke. A lot of weird midcentury art was directly and unsubtly making fun of the art industry and the very idea of commercialized art, and the art industry ate it up and paid tons of money for it
BaloneyBob
johnson442
Even the horse doesn't get it.
nik282000
The two with sand were kinda cool.
twoamartist
I once saw a huge plywood box/room covered with pieces of bologna (like hundreds of pieces) nailed to it, with faces painted on them. And that wasn’t the weirdest thing there either. Whitney Biennial NYC.
numbonvalium
Shit like this makes me resonate with Robert Henri when he criticized the tail end of the Impressionism movement, which he would refer to as "Academic", art for the sake of being art rather than any real expression.
ImurevJourhein
If I were to run into any other building, wearing only boxer shorts, and start screaming and crying while using a sledgehammer to smash a bunch of fruits with insults written on them, ending with screaming "Look what you made me do!" before running off crying, I'd be institutionalized. If I did it at one of these art galleries, I'd get an exhibit and reviews.
moxythree
Are we just doing takes on the OSHA dude now? “I’m OSHA dude but with off artists! Make sure to give me a follow!!”
GoodChange
Sure some art tries too hard and kinda suck because of it but this kind of reaction crap sucks more.
ConfederacyOfDunces
Raecracy123abc
Okay but Im kind of into it after seeing a good performance once. It was by one of the dude's father of Metalica so retirement was locked and he was just this eccentric dude with a trope being weird. It was lights, movement, sounds, wind, big ribbons of fabric, "music" painting things weird in weird ways that all just flowed together. A small audience w no judgement about being into it. It was also before the pervasiveness of phones/ social media so no one seemed to be there just for the cred
orangeyougladididntsaypoop
“Art”
dankymang
This makes me hate the art scene with so much passion. And I’m an artist. Wtf is this bullshit.
FlissFloss86Gaming
jorgenajohnsen3
bibidybop
Why does he need a helmet!?!
PrPlump
I've seen a guy with paint on his dick and balls doing the split on a big sheet of paper, selling the result. Anything goes.
Housemaster
Do they sign their name in a similar fashion?
NothingPrince
So you been to sexbo
BurnieCinders
Pricasso.com
ReturnOfActionCheese
Yoko Ono enters the chat
SomebodythatIusedtonope
Yoko Ono get muted in 10 second
somnif
Honestly, her early performance pieces aren't bad? Like, nothing special about them, but no different than a million other Village art folks
imightbeabearindisguise
Number 9
rainevasquez
I mean, the hate for her is so salty, but her cut piece is so good. Her grapefruit book@is fantastic.
[deleted]
[deleted]
Botticelliii
Laughed my ass when I saw this video for the first time. I was making the same damn face listening to yoko wail and screech until I saw this.
MandalorianFromMandalore
*entire chat leaves*
tr26
Look, if it weren’t for the avant garde, art wouldn’t progress. You don’t have to like it or even get it, but it does matter. I’ve seen some black box plays that made me deeply uncomfortable in indescribable ways and I never saw those playwrights again, but such things need to exist to push boundaries and find new paths
MAN9000
We're, you got a miner of down votes. That kinda makes me sad.
tr26
Maybe they prefer modern interpretative dance
handsMoleman
Totally agree. I feel that for a chunk of people, the expectation is that art is there to look pretty, stuff that's confronting or confusing the gut reaction is to reject it rather than to sit with it or figure out your own interpretation (right or wrong).
aThingWithTheStufAndTheJunk
Yep, just like everything else, art requires a lot of experimentation and failure to get to the good stuff. Otherwise you just end up in the Jack Donaghy mode of "art is paintings of horses, end of list."
tr26
Yup! Don’t get me wrong, I love some good equestrian art as the next guy, but sometimes we need dogs playing poker on black velvet.
CheeseBalls
I appreciate you. Thanks for this. I'm not being sarcastic.
tr26
Casually
There's obviously an audience for it.
userfriendly19777
Various friends and hostages.
ImHereToGetDownvotes
Don't forget the other "art students" who have to cheer and pretend theirs isn't as equally garbage as well.
Casually
Got it. You and I both find t weird and don't get anything out of it therefore nobody would.
userfriendly19777
Casually
Sorry, what is a better, non-strawman way, for me to say there are actually people that do enjoy this stuff and aren't there out of a sense of obligation?
userfriendly19777
Ok, accepted. I kinda agree with you actually. Some of them might enjoy it, or at least appreciate the performances. I, however, also suspect that many are there because they're expected to be there.
volkheath
I will fully defend the right of each and every one of them to express themselves in any manner in which they choose. But I also will have the right to think to myself…what the absolute fuck?
Kokokokko
I reserve the right to not give a fuck
glocksout
That’s often the point
kadaeux
Performance Art or "How to make money from your undiagnosed mental illness 101."
SelfieDiver3000
"The only difference between a starving artist and a successful one is marketing." -Someone smarter than me
myloveforyouislikeatruckberserker
No, come on, cheap shot at mental illness. You could’ve said pretentiousness, lack of talent anything else
aloharamada
Agreed. Now, obviously not all performance art is inherently bad, but most of it has me thinking that the performer craves actor/musician level attention centered on their person (instead of their art, which should speak for itself) but lacks the discipline to learn an instrument or hone their acting skills/memorize their lines. In all fairness, a lot of of the more classic art styles, like f.e. painting and sculpting, have their fair share of hacks as well.
myloveforyouislikeatruckberserker
Oh no argument from me there. Most modern art is first of all selling the artist, then people buy into their art. Regardless of technical skill or substance
aloharamada
Yeah, it's pretty sad. Also, apparently a lot of tax evasion via art donations to museums... after commissioning an artist friend to paint something and paying an art appraiser friend to declare it is worth a lot of cash, so you can write off any amount you want. Atrocious practice, that.
ahorseelbowdeepinme
I like some of it
Boatsntoes
Yep thats pretty much how all of us go through life. Ups and downs and keep working towards your goal.
ahorseelbowdeepinme
I think that's basically the point of the piece. IIRC it was aboutThe ups and Downs of his career
WooWooWooYouKnowIt
Me in the audience trying to figure out what my place in line is. https://imgur.com/q0X6LGx.gif
philsnow
falling with style
FailedMitosis
Me trying to wake up from a good night of sleep.
Lulabel73
I always feel if I can do it it’s not art. I can’t do this.
ahorseelbowdeepinme
Meh, i always think of this
Lulabel73
Do you think part of that is knowing that what you’re going to do is crap and you have more self respect than laying on the floor screaming and asking money for it? There’s a lot of “the emperor's new clothes” going on here
ahorseelbowdeepinme
Art is subjective. That particular piece wasn't for me and I wouldn't expect half that audience to be into what I'm into
Lulabel73
You know how people are going crazy over Stanley cups? Same shit.
ReturnOfActionCheese
This isn't art, it's just bouncing with extra steps
ahorseelbowdeepinme
So is sex but done right it is an art
JumpingHungarian
Underrated joke right here
aznanimality
I mean this requires some serious training and athleticism and coordination...
SirMisterDudeBroPhD
That's beautiful
NairouTryyshokk
I like to share this magnificent piece of art any chance I get.
MissIWasntItching
Not all performance art is pretentious crap. The nonsense just gives the rest of performance art a bad rep.
KittyKlimt6
That is not true
UselessCommenting
I have another opinion: performance art is what it is (= human doing things and you watch) and it should do what it does (= make you talk/think about it). So whatever I don't like it.
Seanspeed
Almost like when there's some aspect of skill/execution involved, it can be interesting even if you dont get the 'metaphor' aspect.
pleaseacknowledgethecat
I want to do that-not watch it
ahorseelbowdeepinme
I could do both
pleaseacknowledgethecat
Same
AdrianDunne
This looks like it wasn't cobbled together at the last minute. I can't say that for the ones in the OP.
ahorseelbowdeepinme
I dunno, I liked the first one. I'd stop for a bit to watch a dude walk around a bunch of eggs with his eyes closed just to see if he could do it
AdrianDunne
Yeah, but he could have popped into a shop at the last minute and picked up a few trays of eggs. Put them around the floor and it's job done. Very ortistic.
quzar
Hey he spent hours hard boiling them all (he only had the one tiny pot) first.
ahorseelbowdeepinme
Yeah but still interesting
AdrianDunne
Only if he breaks an egg.
Haylett777
Where's the original audio? Is it safe? Is it alright?
woozle
man, I can't stand avant garde crap
Ultratoxic
I dunno, this is better than another boring ass painting of some rich dude or Jesus (again) or his mom (again)
senyu
AtmaDarkwolf
THIS is art.
AwfullyFalafely
There's a guy I see at work a lot who looks just like this. It's hard not to think of it every time I see him.
reallybigdogtrappedinamansbody
Contemporary art is a kind of language, if you haven’t read/studied the history and theory it doesn’t make a lot of sense. The problem is that it’s language-ness makes it seem exclusive to people with the time and money to seek it out. The secret is to not take it that seriously in the first place, and find ways to enjoy it, even if it’s like “shit I’ve never seen THAT before.”
Dracology
I've never seen a man eat his own face before either but that doesn't mean its art
reallybigdogtrappedinamansbody
How are you defining art then?
Housemaster
Another harmless explanation buried in the negatives. +1
MandalorianFromMandalore
If it isn't an outright money laundering scam, it's done by a pretentious, elitist prick of an artist who sometimes literally shits on canvas and tells us it's a dream.
PineappleLoopsBroether
I once had to sit through a SILENT dance thing for 90 minutes. No music. No talking. No story.
tsuelue
Had to?! At gunpoint? ^^
woozle
reminds of that guy on crutches who whacks his metal pole dick into another pole a bunch of times. "art"
Tarmaccian
So you’re saying that his absurdist performance had enough impact on you that you still think of it now… whether for better or worse, nobody knows… but it has definitely had an effect…
Unclescam
Art, by it's most basic definition, should simply make the observer feel something....bewilderment barely counts.
SophieClockwise
WhiteNewEnglandClamChowder
"Kids! It's... DINNER TIME!!!!!"
reallybigdogtrappedinamansbody
do you say the same about jazz, poetry, ballet, and other ‘high art’ forms? There’s definitely some exclusive gate-keeping wankery that goes on, but writing off these modes of human expression is part of the anti-intellectualism that runs dangerously through US society. I don’t understand DnD or football, but I don’t think people are pricks for enjoying those things 🤷♂️
apathyboy
I would say it about poetry that didn't use words, meter, or rhyme, or jazz that didn't use instruments or have any rhythm. "Art" that lacks any talent or skill to produce, beauty, perceptible message, or anything else of any artistic merit is, not surprisingly, a pile of worthless garbage.
reallybigdogtrappedinamansbody
But you can see it right? The medium is visual art. Just because you can’t perceive a message doesn’t mean it isn’t there… “I don’t understand this therefore it is garbage” is a bit of a lame take.
apathyboy
Not really. If the artist is attempting to express themselves and nobody understands what they're doing, then they have failed. If they're trying to evoke a reaction and all they get is blank looks and vague embarrassment then they have failed. There are, mathematically speaking, infinite messages in a block of random noise, it just depends how you decrypt it.
OnlyOneArman
I think the difference is, if you don't understand football or D&D, but ask someone who does to describe it to you, the answer is usually given in excitement and joy. If you ask a fan of truly avant garde art, though, you usually get a pretentious, haughty, disdainful, or downright rude answer. "You wouldn't understand." Not always, of course, but often enough that people associate avant garde with people pretending cheap trash is art.
DidItForScience
A bit hyperbolic with your bitter reaction there, the flip side of the coin you're railing against.
MurphysLawEnforcement
Its not hyperbolic, theres fsr worse that artists shitting on their canvas infront of groups of people for "art"
DidItForScience
So you don't see any pretentiousness in their blanket claim that avant garde artists are all scam artists or pretentious elitist pricks? OK then.