liberalconservative
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It's about time we as Americans stop scapegoating individual leaders for our problems and accept the fact that our ignorance of our own political system is the root of the same corruption we are crying about.
TheDreaded1
"What if?'? The electoral college blatantly affirms that the general public can't be trusted, so "just in case" the get extra stupid, boom.
SillyZombie
It's rigged because we allow it to happen. Does that count?
AMS0C
There is such a strong polarization in America. Thats what makes people here stupid.
Wukaro
I'm pretty sure most of us are in agreement that we're all fucked regardless of who wins the election.
Salxikas
Either the voters are stupid or the system is rigged because my candidate didn't win their primary. No other way they could have lost, none
chooseday
Imagine if everyone else who didn't share your opinion wasn't stupid. Woah, mind blown!
cpnbeeb
You're both right and wrong.
ADogNamedStains
It's both, unfortunately.
AtomicDJ
Our election system has very little to do with the average voting citizen. Corporate power chooses for us. Hillary is a perfect example.
Imgurlerker
http://www.iamawake.co/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/Selfish-Ignorant.jpg
ferryp
But citizens who aren't selfish and ignorant do not necessarily end up with benevolent and smart leaders.
flowseeker
What do you suggest we do about it?
formula4speed
My suggestion would be to make eliminating ignorance through an exceptional, easily-accessed education system a top priority
superchickin
Splodgey
Spoiler effect https://youtu.be/s7tWHJfhiyo
thisistheinternetimheretotellliesandarguewithstrangers
Only americans don`t know this.
WhyAmINotASaiyan
Don't say that out loud, the Americans don't like it
natangold
Some of us are less naïve than others.
KdtEmiliano
As an Argentian i assure you have very little corruption in your country.
kurts12gauge
Thank you.
formula4speed
Wouldn't the people who are the most corrupt look like they aren't corrupt, though? I mean part of conning people is not getting caught
jadespider
I blame television and the internet. Before 1950, candidates were rated on the issues. Today it's their tweets and how good they look on TV.
spiderqueendemon
But to be fair, people complained about penny newspapers 'ruining' politics as early as 1800. The media are problematic, but it's not new.
painstream
It has more to do with the media reporting primaries/elections like sports scores instead of actual policy summaries.
SayWhatYouMeanMeanWhatYouSay
Not sure why you got downvoted, this is spot on, the first televised debate is perfect evidence.
ArmorcladCowboy
Exactly, the first televised debate Kennedy v Nixon, TV watchers said pretty boy Kennedy won but radio listeners heavily sided with Nixon.
DAFUQisaLOMMY
Here's the thing though: it REALLY is rigged, and it's designed to pander to the dumbest citizens we have to offer. Yes, it is a design 1/2
DAFUQisaLOMMY
of our own ignorance, but the fact that it's almost impossible to change the system, now that more people are catching on, is wrong 2/2
ali4z
Can you guys at least wait with a revolution until the middle east has calmed down? We already busy enough handing current refugees. Thanks.
WhyAmINotASaiyan
With how gun happy their police are, I don't think there would ever be one.
Rheios
A vast constituency of our population is armed, which is the entire point by the way, just to be able to combat that very thing.(1)
Rheios
That being said, frankly its not so bad as everyone seems to think. We're just going through the death rattles of one of the parties(2)
BoobiesMeow
How do I know you're not the stupid one?
rudegoldberg
"Democracy depends on educated voters." Uh, I think I've found the problem.
GWPlunkitt
That's impossible, because it would require a certain level of self-reflection and thought instead of blind bashing of "the politicians".
ThePowerOf42
As an European. Makes sense.. Really
RacecarIsRacecarBackwards
Imagine if a European had made this post, it would have been torn apart. Good to see they're developing some self awareness.
Cere4l
as a dutch person, its been ages since i last had any faith in my goverment.
RacecarIsRacecarBackwards
As a German.... tell me about it.
ThePowerOf42
As a dane.. Yep...
kc82
Thinking inline with the majority of the online community doesn't make you "right" or more intelligent than other voters. Sorry.
Quarantine000
This is seriously what I've been saying the whole time.
PauLogic
Well if we don't vote that makes us pretty stupid too.
stillborntoiletbaby
A horribly large portion of Americans are ignorant, narcissistic, self righteous morons.
seijirou
This is true. Americans are a category of humans, and what is true for humans is true for Americans.
JapaneseStudentTadashii
But you are not. You are much smarter and more self aware than the rest of America.
Yoshi2032
Sounds more like these idiots here on imgur.
Dispatcher007
Yep. It's sad how many of us here distort incoming information to fit our preconceptions instead of letting the information guide to truth.
GavinScreaming
r/neckbeardquotes
spacewrangler
A horribly large portion of (eligible) Americans did not get out and vote. That's why this mess exists
RacecarIsRacecarBackwards
A lot of Americans don't realise that voting (though not really making a difference) is the only way of raising their voice these days.
ImguriansFillMySaltReservoir
A horribly large portion of largely uninformed voters is why this mess exists. People who literally vote just because they're supposed to.
spacewrangler
A little column A a little column B. Our voter turn out is despicable but a lot of show up just to vote for whatever the tv says is best
Thundering165
But not us, right?
ShafeenA
They're also on both sides of the political spectrum
CatBlaster5000
You would be correct. I wonder if it's the same in Canada.
peopleperson
Politically? Less so. On a human scale I would imagine it's the same wherever you go. Selfish idiots are everywhere.
CatBlaster5000
This is a sad time. Blessed with access to knowledge, and therefore painfully aware of how many lack any sense of it.
peopleperson
Don't lose heart. Humans have been essentially the same for millenia. The majority of people struggle to get by or work just hard enougn /1
peopleperson
so their ends are tended to and not give a shit after that. There will also always be those who push us all forward. /2
stfuplease
That kind of sweeping generalization sounds like something an ignorant, narcissistic, self-righteous moron would say.
stillborntoiletbaby
I am an American after all
myshoescramp
Like this? https://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/sheeple.png Thinking they're not the same?
The2ndHank
Just remember you are a unique individual, just like everyone else. ~ Margaret Mead
stfuplease
Exactly, I just think the kind of attitude in the original comment never solves anything.
TEDwisdom
If taken as a an over-arching philosophy, that kind of attitude would be harmful, yes. But it's important to be aware of the possibility
mcshady
Everybody bitches about them, but nobody votes in primaries.
dontmagpie
oh my god stop. have you looked at what the media reports vs what actually happens? fuck off.
frickenunbelievable
Read "Democracy in America" by Alexis De Tocqueville. Trump was predicted 200 years ago by a frenchman.
prettykitties
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decamping
Yep. Also thought it was interesting how he predicted how the arts would suffer too. Good reads! Good on you!
KharnApproves
Democracy in America should be required reading.
Xenarion
I've heard of his work and its impressive. It's on my to-read list.
zsevern
Great books. 1 and 2. Highly recommended
ShafeenA
.
KharnApproves
Idk know why you were downvoted. You dotted because you want to read a book and expand your perspective. Good for you!
ShafeenA
Lol I dont even care, oh no not my meaningless internet points!! 1!
Nalikill
The dark night of fascism is always descending in America but lands only in Europe.
override367
Trump isn't as bad as barry goldwater who won the nomination in 1964, goldwater drew even bigger crowds
override367
Goldwater also got fucking annihilated by Johnson, a political player no better than Clinton (but he gave us important reforms!)
stratus41298
Its really nothing new. We like to act like we're more civilized now but we're really still a bunch of cocks.
TheGhostofLionelHutz
Another great historical take on our current situation. http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/04/america-tyranny-donald-trump.html
override367
Too democratic? Voter turnout is crazy low, I bet most of the people on this site don't vote
TheGhostofLionelHutz
I know the article is long. But really try to read past the title. It's well written and at the very least, thought provoking.
rshackleford
Trump's not the first demagogue to rise to prominence in the u.s. and he won't be the last
IHateCaptchaCodes
True... McCarthy (although a senator not a president) and his whole spurious communist infiltration agenda managed that over 50 years ago
KunFayyaKun
there is a difference between "prominence" and giving him the means to probably one of the most powerful seats in the world.
EtherealAppeal
Um. No.
RawwrrRawwrrLikeaDungeonDragon
Has any americans been checking into what laws the congress has been passing quietly during these elections?
FluffyPuddles
https://medium.com/govtrack-insider/election-season-hasn-t-distracted-congress-from-enacting-new-laws-ee4a15113ec9#.up1p5zh6c
VoidIncarnate
Bathroom Bill.
FluffyPuddles
U.S. to Send Military Advisers Closer to Front Lines in Iraq http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/19/world/middleeast/obama-isis-iraq.html?_r=0
FluffyPuddles
We currently have an extremely lazy legislature. Many of us are hoping to change that soon.
SweetStache
Nothing too huge. During elections, especially of a president leaving office, usually nothing huge happens. It's whenever nothing is
SweetStache
Really going on that you've got to watch out. The only big thing our media isn't covering is unrest in the rest of the world and
SweetStache
Anything we may be doing in the Middle East
RawwrrRawwrrLikeaDungeonDragon
Was just wondering because this election-shit has been ridiculous for so long
SweetStache
That's American election seasons for you
SomeWhiteKid
Fucking Skinheads on /pol/ check what laws Congress passes on an hourly basis just to justify the mass murder of jews. Trust me I know
AmSaiCo
I like how after October your every fourth comment is about /pol/
SweetStache
I uh, don't think those 2 things are connected
Salpinus
Non us here. I understood nothing of that comment :p
goldfishlaser
/pol/ is a board on 4chan full of white supremesists & neo nazis. But I dunno what he means by it either....
Salpinus
Ah! Thanks. That makes the comment readable. Though I don't get the context. Oh well
JohmBambo
And the mofos want the TTIP. As european no way in hell.
Jusmar
Oh yeah the European TPP. Enjoy
RacecarIsRacecarBackwards
At least as long as they don't say what's in it.
Sidelinert
Search the inter-webs, its out there
RacecarIsRacecarBackwards
I know, it was leaked. Still it's only a draft and no one knows what it's gonna look like in the end.
JuraraJupiter
Even if it isn't rigged per se, things have been happening in key primaries that shouldn't be happening, regardless of intent.
JuraraJupiter
But, if people weren't stupid, that wouldn't matter. So, it's a mixture of a failed system, and a failed species.
DapperButtSlapper
It is rigged. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tu32">A_Ig">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tu32CCA_Ig and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPKKQnijnsM
MLPNightshade
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TenThousandYears
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NoBeerandNoTvMakeHomerSomethingSomething
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NoOddJob
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liberalconservative
2) uniformly, not different in every state. Also, the amount of leverage smaller dates have over bigger states in this process is just dumb
liberalconservative
*states
DerickZellar
At the drop of a hat. They set the rules before the process starts and it all can change at the last second on nomination day. Secondly 2/?
DerickZellar
The smaller states? It exists in the current way so everyone's voice is heard properly. Also you can win the state but certain areas 4/?
DerickZellar
If they give large states more pull than small states (which large ones kind of have) what point is there spending money talking and to 3/?
DerickZellar
You are so naive my sweet summer child. A) the parties make the rules for the primaries before the general election and they can change 1/?
DerickZellar
Vote the oposite way. Now this would be an easier discussion without a character limit but alas I'm on mobile. But the system has flaws. End
SpellOfVishanti
1)Dude I am a registered democrat in Kentucky I haven't had the chance to vote for shit yet. We have closed primaries here so...
SpellOfVishanti
2) I don't even get to vote until May 17, and even then I had no impact on the republican primaries that already took place.
JuraraJupiter
The most dumb thing I see, out of all the things, including the mixture of caucuses and open/closed primaries, confusion over party /1
JuraraJupiter
affiliation, the most dumb thing is not having everyone be registered to vote at 18. That would solve a lot of issues. /2
Cereaza
First time I went to vote at 19, i was told I couldn't... because I didn't register... I was baffled.
CwispyNoodles
You misunderstand one thing, political parties are not the govt themselves so they can choose whoever runs in the general election 1/2
AncientSeraph
Wait, your comment should've been to Jurara, not OP. OP's actually correct here.
AncientSeraph
Yuuup. At first this felt strange, but then I remembered this is exactly how it goes in Holland. You pick your party, they pick their PM.
CwispyNoodles
I don know why i made a second part 2/2
Cereaza
I think you wanted to explain how the DNC and RNC are basically privately run organizations who can do whatever they fuck they want.
ideologist
So I could upvote you twice, you glorious bastard +2
liberalconservative
1) If we weren't ignorant of how the electorate works, we would change the way primaries are held. Federal elections should be handled
spookyu
"we would change" is the only part I'd take issue with here, it's out of most people's hands realistically, that's done on purpose.
liberalconservative
If everyone suddenly became an independent, we would literally change the entire election system as the parties would have to adjust.
Thewondersquid
That's a huge "if".
WhatsInANameMeByAnyOtherNameWouldBeJustAsLonely
First past the post voting forces a two party system. We'd just form parties all over a gain, it's far too natural under the system.
spookyu
Two parties isn't necessarily bad, it ensures there's a true majority -instead of 20% of the population deciding on something as opposed 1/2